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EDUCATION LEGISLATION-1963

THURSDAY, JUNE 27, 1963

U.S. SENATE,
SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION OF THE
COMMITTEE ON LABOR AND PUBLIC WELFARE,

Washington, D.C. The subcommittee met, pursuant to recess, at 10 a.m., in room 4232, New Senate Office Building, Senator Wayne Morse (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Present: Senators Morse (presiding), Yarborough, Clark, Randolph, and Pell.

Also present: Senators Pell (member of the full committee), and Ribicoff

, of Connecticut. Committee staff members present: Stewart E. McClure, chief clerk; Charles Lee, professional staff member of the subcommittee; Michael J. Bernstein, minority counsel; and Ray Hurley, associate minority counsel.

Senator Morse. The hearing will come to order.

With the testimony we are privileged to hear this morning the public hearings on S. 580, the National Education Improvement Act of 1963 will come to a close.

CLOSING OF THE RECORD

The record of the hearings will remain open for the inclusion of supplementary statements, rebuttal statements, and the provision to the subcommittee of requested materials until the close of business July 15, 1963.

The Chair reserves the right, with respect to materials requested from various agencies and branches of the Government, to extend further time as needed if an adequate justification is supplied. However, I wish to make it perfectly clear to all agencies, from which we have requested information, that I have a pressing desire in behalf of

my subcommittee that every effort be made by them to expedite delivery to the subcommittee of the data which has been requested by July 15. In the opinion of the Chair, that is ample time, but there may be some exigency that justifies an agency asking for a few days more. If that is necessary, I shall, of course, grant it.

In bringing to a close these hearings this morning, I want to say that I think we are closing the best record on education hearings that has been held in my nearly 19 years in the Senate. I have participated, as far as I know, in each and every one of those hearings.

INTRODUCTION OF ADMIRAL RICKOVER

We have had presented to us in these hearings testimony, memoran dums, documents, and exhibits which, in my judgment, could serve to comprise the contents of several fine books on the educational problems of this country. As I said the other day, collectively they could be the basis for several Ph. D. and master's theses. I am particularly in pleased that the closing chapter of these hearings is going to be written in part by one of the great Americans of our time. I refer, of 100 course, to the incomparable Admiral Rickover.

He is to be our first witness this morning. The subcommittee is departing from its pattern in these hearings in that we are asking Vice Admiral Rickover to discuss with this subcommittee not the specific bill S. 580, but rather the educational goals for the United States, which, in his view, should be kept in mind during the consideration of any legislation in the field of education.

I want to take upon myself and assume full responsibility for making these comments to the press and to others, who may subce. quently make use of the testimony before us this morning,

It is my knowledge that Admiral Rickover is in the midst of completing a very important and scholarly book on the general subjeca of educational objectives, the first part of which will appear shortly in a leading periodical in this country.

Therefore it was with some hesitancy that the admiral agreed to testify this morning, for a good many of the things he will say

this morning will undoubtedly be covered in this periodical article and will be covered in a subsequent book. Although no permission is needed for any newspaper or newspaper periodical to refer to his testimony this morning, nevertheless, the manuscript which he will read to us has a copyright notice attached to it and is not to be used by periodicals and publications in this country, except as appropriate under copyright law.

I want, also, to say from my personal knowledge that the admiral was not only somewhat hesitant to testify this morning before this subcommittee, because of the fact that he is publishing a book and periodical articles, but also that the admiral is not interested in commercials.

I point out, however, that the income the admiral receives from all of his writings is donated to charity. He does not get personal benefit from a single cent which he receives from this source. This is another reason why I thought that this kind of a dedicated man ought to be brought before us to testify this morning. He is an outstanding example to the young people of this country, who are represented in the hearing room today

Later this morning, the Chair intends to discuss some testimony which a group of students in the room presented to him earlier and which he will, at that time, make a part of the record. The material was presented by a committee of students from the District of Columbia high schools who are making a plea to the people of the United States to do something about the shocking conditions in education in the District of Columbia.

I shall not, however, take time to discuss that matter while we

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INTRODUCTION OF ADMIRAL RICKOVER duction. His zeal, his great competence in his field have written for

him a great chapter in the annals of the American Navy. We are We have had presented to us in these hearings testimony

, me pleased to welcome him to the stand this morning.
dums, documents
, and exhibits which, in my judgment

, coulder
Admiral

, having made these deserved comments about you, I am comprise the contents of several fine books on the educational tempted to see if my flint can strike fire from your steel and my first of this country. As I said the other day, collectively they question is

, for this record, will you tell us why you are interested in the basis for several Ph. D. and master's theses

. I an paris education to the great degree that you are? pleased that the closing chapter of these hearings is going to bed ten in part by one of the great Americans of our time I HE STATEMENT OF VICE ADM. HYMAN G. RICKOVER, ASSISTANT course, to the incomparable Admiral Rickover.

CHIEF OF BUREAU FOR NUCLEAR PROPULSION, BUREAU OF He is to be our first witness this morning. The subeamna

SHIPS. U.S. NAVY departing from its pattern in these hearings in that we are Vice Admiral Rickover to discuss with this subcommittee Admiral RICKOVER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for your very graspecific bill S. 580, but rather the educational goals for the lo eius comments. I must say in the beginning I am not attempting to States, which, in his view, should be kept in mind during the challenge you in your forensic art. Your lucid statements impress me sideration of any legislation in the field of education. and I am no competitor whatever.

I want to take upon myself and assume full responstir Senator Morse. I wish I had half your ability. making these comments to the press and to others, who mate Admiral RICKOVER. The usual question put to me represents a disquently make use of the testimony before us this morning.

trust by people that anybody who is not in a particular field can really It is my knowledge that Admiral

Rickover is in the mids de discuss it. All the work I do on education is after work hours, after pleting a very important and scholarly book on the generals a very busy and demanding schedule. As you well know, I have pracof educational objectives, the first part of which will appear sin tiely no social life, because I feel it is my duty as a citizen of a a leading periodical in this country.

democracy such as ours to engage in public activities outside of my Therefore it was with some hesitancy that the admiril as work, as it is the duty of every other citizen.

No democracy can retestify this morning, for a good many of the things he premain viable if citizens do not engage in public

activities. The only morning will undoubtedly be covered in this periodical aries we they can assure their private rights to freedom, to pursuit of

way will be covered in a subsequent book. Although no permitin appines, and all that goes with democracy is by actually engaging needed for any newspaper or newspaper periodical to per la public debate on public isves. asoro, ras well as other members of estimony this morning, nevertheless, the manuscript which he

our society, engage in these activities. s periodicals and publications in this country, except as appute it as a gimmick to still the voice of criticism. I would be satisfied nder copyright law.

il I thonght that it was only a gimmick. But the horrifying thought I want, also, to say from my personal knowledge that the saurs to me that they really mean this, and if they do mean it, it as not only somewhat hesitant to testify this morning beriebenstrates a complete distrust of the process of education. Educabcommittee, because of the fact that he is publishing a bon two means to learn about things that have happened at all times and eriodical articles, but also that the admiral is not interested all ages. If one is to confine himself only to what he can learn ercials. I point out, however, that the income the admiral receive one and to the bakery and to the police department. So there is a

Today, then education should consist of nothing but visits to the fireI of his writings is donated to charity. He does not get pas complete denial of the validity of the mental process. For example, netit from a single cent which he receives from this source to follow this thing through to its logical extent, no one could write another reason why I thought that this kind of a dedicated history of the Civil War unless he had been a drummer body in the anding example to the young people of this country, who aretes cook and no one could vote for a legislator unless he had already

ght to be brought before us to testify this morning. He is al Civil War and nobody could tell whether a meal was good unless he zted in the hearing room today, Later this morning, the Chair intends to discuss some test ich a group of students in the room presented to him earned fares. The teachers, the administrators, are all public employees;

Actually, schools are public institutions. They are paid out of ich he will, at that time, make a part of the record. The they are public employees such as you and I and, therefore, we should presented by a commitme of students from the District de

e subject to criticism. This is my vindication for talking about abia high schools who are making a plea to the people de ited States to do something about the shocking conditions in Senator Morse. You have already answered in good part the other on in the District of Columbia.

question I was going to put to you. You are far ahead of me, but I waiting to hear Admiral Rickover. The admiral needs now. I was going to ask you before this excellent statement you shall not, however, take time to discuss that matter while en gång to state them for the record and let your answer speak for

just made, granted your preeminence in other areas, why do you feel you are qualified to talk and testify on education, or how do you pro pose to qualify yourself in the educational arena to speak with author ity on standards for educational excellence.

I have no doubt that the formal statement we are about to hear will amplify the answer you have already given to this question in your preliminary statement.

I have before me a statement under your signature, entitled " National Standard for Education.” It is my suggestion that you read the statement and that the members of the subcommittee as you questions on it when you have finished. I am pleased my colleague from West Virginia, Senator Randolph

, 253 who has been one of the most ardent supporters of educational reform and educational support in this country is with me to hear you this morning. Other members of the subcommittee expressed to me deep regret that they cannot be here. Some do hope to come before we finish.

You may proceed, now, Admiral, in your own way.
Admiral RICKOVER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I will read my statement, which is entitled “A National Standard for Education.”

Senator MORSE. I interrupt long enough to welcome Senator Pronts, of Vermont, who has joined us to hear you.

Senator PROUTY. Thank you.

Admiral RICKOVER. Mr. Chairman, I know from the many times ! have appeared before committees of Congress how deeply concerned Members of Congress are about the education of our children.

CHIEF CONCERN SHOULD BE EDUCATION

As Aristotle said, "Nobody could doubt that the chief concern of the lawgiver must be the education of the young." Over the years in the many private discussions I have been privileged to have with individual Members, I have also felt their concern. I feel that no real and timely improvement will be made unless you take the lead and show the way. You are the highest and most representative organ in the United States for getting things done and you have the power of the purse to make your deliberations effective. Congress has rightly been called the “potent and omnipresent teacher.”

All great philosophers have understood that the education of youth is the primary function of society—the means by which humanity's inheritance is transmitted from one generation to another. When one reflects on the matter he must see that each one of us is heir to all of the ideas and accomplishments of every human being who has ever lived. This is why education is so important, why it is our responsibility as human beings to assure that our own heirs receive their full human inheritance.

Further, as Plato said, "most issues exercising the lawgiver can be settled only by reference to the basic problem of the citizen's

If we adult Americans are not intelligent enough to figure out & way to improve American education, we cannot hope that our children will be intelligent enough to keep our Nation strong and prosperous

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